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Novice na temo orožja in strelstva v tujini
#41
No saj VZ 58 je zdaj prepovedan, kot vidim tudi PCC (CZ Scorpion). Razumem strah ljudi ampak a ni imel tip puške iz USA, sploh ni bil lastnik kosov?

Me pa zanima, v USA ko enkrat kupiš kos, nihče več ne preverja nič (torej kje ga hraniš) in ali ga moraš ob prodaji prijaviti? Kolikor sem zasledil je dosti tega, da ljudje prodajo naprej? Po mojem mnenju bi že tu lahko naredili nekaj reda tam. Konkreten pregled pred nakupom kot v EU (vključno s psihotestom, ni vsak nekaznovan v resnici gladek), obvezno hranjenje v sefu in ob izgubi ali prodaji prijaviti.
Sem pa dobil zanimivo primerjavo, situacija je približno taka kot bi "nekdo" nabasan v Krškem ali pa Črnomlju z neregistriranim cliom povozil par ljudi, nakar bi po celi EU prepovedali vozila z več kot 150 konji.

Se oproščam ker smo že toliko offtopic.
Odgovori
#42
(02-05-2020, 12:29)bob78 Napisal: Po prebranem kaže, da bodo v roku 2 let morali kose prodati izven Kanade, deaktivirati ali ponuditi v odkup organom. Pogoji za odkup še niso določeni. Uporaba je od včeraj prepovedana. Prenos je možen le za namene prodaje ali deaktivacije, pri tem pa orožje ne sme biti na vidnem mestu, v vozilu pa ne sme biti prisotnega streliva.
Me zanima, kakšna bo odkupna cena.

(02-05-2020, 15:30)Symon Napisal: No saj VZ 58 je zdaj prepovedan, kot vidim tudi PCC (CZ Scorpion). Razumem strah ljudi ampak a ni imel tip puške iz USA, sploh ni bil lastnik kosov?

Me pa zanima, v USA ko enkrat kupiš kos, nihče več ne preverja nič (torej kje ga hraniš) in ali ga moraš ob prodaji prijaviti? Kolikor sem zasledil je dosti tega, da ljudje prodajo naprej? Po mojem mnenju bi že tu lahko naredili nekaj reda tam. Konkreten pregled pred nakupom kot v EU (vključno s psihotestom, ni vsak nekaznovan v resnici gladek), obvezno hranjenje v sefu in ob izgubi ali prodaji prijaviti.
Sem pa dobil zanimivo primerjavo, situacija je približno taka kot bi "nekdo" nabasan v Krškem ali pa Črnomlju z neregistriranim cliom povozil par ljudi, nakar bi po celi EU prepovedali vozila z več kot 150 konji.

Se oproščam ker smo že toliko offtopic.
Ne bo šlo, razen če bi bil clio RS, mislim, slaba primerjava :p
Odgovori
#43
Bistvo je v neregistriranem avtu in pijanem vozniku (neregistrirano orožje in psihič), in potem prepovejo vse kar je "bolj nevarno".
Odgovori
#44
(02-05-2020, 16:22)Symon Napisal: Bistvo je v neregistriranem avtu in pijanem vozniku (neregistrirano orožje in psihič), in potem prepovejo vse kar je "bolj nevarno".
Saj razumem, malo sem se pohecal.

A Beretta Cx4 Storm je tudi jurišno orožje?
Odgovori
#45
A Beretta Cx4 Storm je tudi jurišno orožje?

Nomen est omen - kaj pa naj bo drugega, če ima storm v imenu. Cela ta jurišnost in kategoriziranje po izgledu je ena velika neumnost - ampak kaj moremo, če je se je morala racionalnost umakniti ustvarjanju videza, da politika nekaj ukrepa.

Lep pozdrav, Marko
Odgovori
#46
Še "jušno zelenjavo" so prepovedali, ker se je nekomu izraz "jušna" zdel preveč podoben izrazu "jurišna"...
Odgovori
#47
Najprej se vrsto sredstev, marsikdaj arbitrarno, uvrsti med orožja, ob tem pa se ljudje požvižgajo na definicijo tega termina. Nato si nekdo uzurpira termin »napadalno orožje« in tja mimo vseh definicij uvrsti nekatera ognjena strelna sredstva, ker jih zakonodajalec pač želi izločiti iz okolja.

Razlogov za zgoraj opisani trend je več. Pomembno krivdo za to nosi strokovna in zainteresirana javnost, saj so bili v preteklosti premalo aktivni in so se zanašali na načelo reka »ne diraj lava, dok spava«, oziroma, so bili s stanjem celo zadovoljni. Žal lahko vidimo podoben trend tudi v Sloveniji.
Odgovori
#48
(02-05-2020, 17:22)Kristian Napisal: Še "jušno zelenjavo" so prepovedali, ker se je nekomu izraz "jušna" zdel preveč podoben izrazu "jurišna"...
Dumb

(02-05-2020, 17:17)Rombon Napisal: A Beretta Cx4 Storm je tudi jurišno orožje?

Nomen est omen - kaj pa naj bo drugega, če ima storm v imenu. Cela ta jurišnost in kategoriziranje po izgledu je ena velika neumnost - ampak kaj moremo, če je se je morala racionalnost umakniti ustvarjanju videza, da politika nekaj ukrepa.

Lep pozdrav, Marko
Mogoče bi morali ar15 preimenovav 'Gun Of Peace', pa bi se izognila listi?
Odgovori
#49
(02-05-2020, 12:18)pacman87 Napisal: “ Kanadska vlada že obstoječim lastnikom sicer orožja ne bo zaplenila, napoveduje pa Trudeau zakon, po katerem bo tistim, ki so se ga pripravljeni odpovedati, ponudila odkup. Poleg tega Trudeaujev ukrep predvideva prehodno obdobje dveh let.”

Je pa zanimivo, kar je razvidno iz tega seznama, da bodo prepovedane tudi .50cal repetirke, pa očitno so imeli v Kanadi do zdaj dovoljene 20mm bombomete (glede na to da so sedaj na listi prepovedanih orožij)
:)
Presneto, pa res, na listi so tudi minometi, vključno z argentinskim 120 mm.
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#50
Symon ti ne veš kaj pomeni beseda svoboda, pa verjetno tudi kaj pomeni odgovornost.
Važno da vse mama država predpiše potem je vse ok.
lp Melly
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#51
Kanada ima drugače bore malo nasilja z temi kosi v zadnjih 30letih

2 ustreljena za AR 15 prešvercanimi prov za ta obrčun iz ZDA
14 mrtvih strelski pohod 1989 z Ruger Mini 14
5 mrtvih v streljanju kjer je bil uporabljen Norinco M14
in eno pokanje z 6 mrtvimi kjer je bil uporabljen CZ58  ki je zaštekal tako da so bile žrtve predvsem od pištole
Odgovori
#52
Tle se niso ustavili samo pri prepovedi "vojaškega" orožja ampak so prepovedali tudi vse kalibre večje ob .37
Tole je bil odličen izgovor za še enega liberalca, da se pod pretvezo "za življenja gre" uvede zelo radikalna prepoved orožja. NAslednji korak bo prepoved pištol, le pri dolgih ceveh bo verjetno malo ohladil ker bo to težko spravil skozi zaradi kanadskega podeželja.
Odgovori
#53
Pojem "vojaško orožje" je še ena pogruntacija, ki nima prav nobene strokovne podlage in je zasnovana docela umetno, vsaj v kontekst, v katerem se uporablja! Navzlic temu je uporaba pogosta. Dejansko, so to le sredstva, ki jih uporablja tudi vojska.

Ker zainteresirana in strokovna javnost pristaja na razpravo o "orožju", se pogosto zapletamo v nesmisle. Ti potem kulminirajo v takšne zadeve, kot je pričujoča najnovejša kanadska prepoved.

Zgolj v razmislek tistim, ki menijo, da je sedanji koncept ustrezen. V kolikor je pomemben zgolj namen ob projektiranju določenega sredstva, kar nekateri trdijo, čeprav je celo tega marsikdaj težko ugotoviti, zakaj ni v parlament, sodišče, ali kako drugo posebej varovano območje, dovoljeno vnesti noža, izvijača, ipd.? Če v primeru prvega ni mogoče z gotovostjo določiti specifičnega namena (le splošnega, ki je rezanje, oziroma prebadanje), pri izvijaču to nedvomno ni izvajanje boja. Očitno je, da imajo varnostniki drugačno, logiko metodologije za presojanje potencialne nevarnosti sredstev. Zanje je pomembna zgolj tehnična lastnost sredstva in s tem povezana potencialna nevarnost le tega, kar je seveda edino smiselno.
Odgovori
#54
Ljudje so premalo brali pravljice ali pa jim noben ni razložil le teh...
V Trnulčici so narobe razumeli kralja, ki je premalo razmišljal... prepovedal je vse kolovrate v deželi, čeprav je vedel za 13-o, zlobno vilo, ki je imela kriminalen načrt, kolovrat z črnega trga...
Odgovori
#55
(03-05-2020, 06:54)Kristian Napisal: Tle se niso ustavili samo pri prepovedi "vojaškega" orožja ampak so prepovedali tudi vse kalibre večje ob .37
Tole je bil odličen izgovor za še enega liberalca, da se pod pretvezo "za življenja gre" uvede zelo radikalna prepoved orožja. NAslednji korak bo prepoved pištol, le pri dolgih ceveh bo verjetno malo ohladil ker bo to težko spravil skozi zaradi kanadskega podeželja.
Justin Trudeau bi storil vse, da ljudje pozabijo na njegov rasistični 'blackface' spodrsljaj. Smile
Odgovori
#56
(03-05-2020, 06:54)Kristian Napisal: Tle se niso ustavili samo pri prepovedi "vojaškega" orožja ampak so prepovedali tudi vse kalibre večje ob .37
Tole je bil odličen izgovor za še enega liberalca, da se pod pretvezo "za življenja gre" uvede zelo radikalna prepoved orožja. NAslednji korak bo prepoved pištol, le pri dolgih ceveh bo verjetno malo ohladil ker bo to težko spravil skozi zaradi kanadskega podeželja.

Še malo pa bodo na nivoju VB , zdaj so skovali nov izraz za bodoče omejitve "municipal handgun" , torej naslednja tarča lastniki orožja v mestih.

OTTAWA — Prime Minister Justin Trudeau defended his assault-rifle ban on Sunday and promised to go even further by targeting handguns and tightening border security with new legislation introduced in the Parliament.

Yet he stopped short of providing a timeline for when such measures would be introduced, saying only that the federal Liberal government would move forward with legislation "when Parliament allows."
The comments came during the prime minister's daily COVID-19 news conference after the government on Friday outlawed a wide range of assault-style weapons. The ban did not require parliamentary approval and was instead published in regulations in the Canada Gazette.
Some have said the ban doesn't go far enough and should include handguns while others have argued that it targets legal gun owners and that Ottawa should instead focus on the smuggling of illegal weapons at the border and stronger jail sentences.
Trudeau acknowledged his government has more work to do when it comes to guns in Canada, which was why it was working on legislation that will deal with the border, gun storage and handguns.
Exactly when will that legislation be introduced, however, appears to be anyone's guess.
"We know there is more to do on strengthening gun control in this country which is why we're going to be moving forward when Parliament allows it with stronger measures around borders, stronger measures around safe storage," Trudeau said.
"Measures around handguns to permit municipalities to ban handguns within their city limits."
Legislation will also need to be introduced around a two-year amnesty and a buyback program that will allow the current owners of assault rifles covered by Friday's ban to receive compensation for turning in the designated firearms or keep them through a grandfathering process.
The Liberal government will move forward on that front "at the first opportunity when the House turns its attention to things other than" COVID-19, Trudeau said. 
The House of Commons has limited its sitting to one in-person and two virtual per week due to the pandemic.
The assault-rifle ban came only weeks after one of the deadliest mass shootings in Canadian history, when a man dressed as an RCMP officer killed 22 people in Nova Scotia on April 18 and 19. Police have indicated the man had two rifles and several handguns on his possession at the time.
Some have accused the prime minister of using the tragedy to instigate a ban while Parliament is largely consumed with the COVID-19 pandemic, while others have questioned why the government waited so long.
The Liberals promised in the last election campaign to ban assault rifles and introduce legislation allowing cities to ban handguns.

Trudeau refused to apologize for the ban after Ontario Premier Doug Ford on Saturday said it targeted legal gun owners. He suggested Ottawa should instead focus on smuggling of illegal weapons at the border and strengthening jail sentences for gun crimes.

"We've seen far too many mass shootings in which military-style-assault weapons were used to kill innocent Canadians. In Sainte-Foy. Recently in Nova Scotia. Back at l'Ecole Polytechnique 30 years ago," Trudeau said.

"We've seen far too many cases in which these guns have caused devastation to families and communities. That's why it was time to ban them. This is something that we were able to do through regulations so it didn't require legislation."
This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 3, 2020.
Lee Berthiaume, The Canadian Press
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#57
Osnovna definicija leiberalca naj bi bila da je bolj toleranten na stvari v okolici (liberal attitude toward anything means more tolerance - Oxford English Dictionary) ampak očitno temu ni tako.
Lahko se šemiš iv karkoli n si izmišlljaš 1001 spol ampak pri orožju pa katastrofa, konec sveta.
Mam še kaj za povedat, ampak tle itak prepričuješ prepričane... đabe to
Odgovori
#58
To so liberalci zgolj po imenu. Ker je pač moderno. V resnici je to svetlobna leta daleč od liberalizma.
Odgovori
#59
(04-05-2020, 15:46)mr.T Napisal:
(03-05-2020, 06:54)Kristian Napisal: Tle se niso ustavili samo pri prepovedi "vojaškega" orožja ampak so prepovedali tudi vse kalibre večje ob .37
Tole je bil odličen izgovor za še enega liberalca, da se pod pretvezo "za življenja gre" uvede zelo radikalna prepoved orožja. NAslednji korak bo prepoved pištol, le pri dolgih ceveh bo verjetno malo ohladil ker bo to težko spravil skozi zaradi kanadskega podeželja.

Še malo pa bodo na nivoju VB , zdaj so skovali nov izraz za bodoče omejitve "municipal handgun" , torej naslednja tarča lastniki orožja v mestih.

OTTAWA — Prime Minister Justin Trudeau defended his assault-rifle ban on Sunday and promised to go even further by targeting handguns and tightening border security with new legislation introduced in the Parliament.

Yet he stopped short of providing a timeline for when such measures would be introduced, saying only that the federal Liberal government would move forward with legislation "when Parliament allows."
The comments came during the prime minister's daily COVID-19 news conference after the government on Friday outlawed a wide range of assault-style weapons. The ban did not require parliamentary approval and was instead published in regulations in the Canada Gazette.
Some have said the ban doesn't go far enough and should include handguns while others have argued that it targets legal gun owners and that Ottawa should instead focus on the smuggling of illegal weapons at the border and stronger jail sentences.
Trudeau acknowledged his government has more work to do when it comes to guns in Canada, which was why it was working on legislation that will deal with the border, gun storage and handguns.
Exactly when will that legislation be introduced, however, appears to be anyone's guess.
"We know there is more to do on strengthening gun control in this country which is why we're going to be moving forward when Parliament allows it with stronger measures around borders, stronger measures around safe storage," Trudeau said.
"Measures around handguns to permit municipalities to ban handguns within their city limits."
Legislation will also need to be introduced around a two-year amnesty and a buyback program that will allow the current owners of assault rifles covered by Friday's ban to receive compensation for turning in the designated firearms or keep them through a grandfathering process.
The Liberal government will move forward on that front "at the first opportunity when the House turns its attention to things other than" COVID-19, Trudeau said. 
The House of Commons has limited its sitting to one in-person and two virtual per week due to the pandemic.
The assault-rifle ban came only weeks after one of the deadliest mass shootings in Canadian history, when a man dressed as an RCMP officer killed 22 people in Nova Scotia on April 18 and 19. Police have indicated the man had two rifles and several handguns on his possession at the time.
Some have accused the prime minister of using the tragedy to instigate a ban while Parliament is largely consumed with the COVID-19 pandemic, while others have questioned why the government waited so long.
The Liberals promised in the last election campaign to ban assault rifles and introduce legislation allowing cities to ban handguns.

Trudeau refused to apologize for the ban after Ontario Premier Doug Ford on Saturday said it targeted legal gun owners. He suggested Ottawa should instead focus on smuggling of illegal weapons at the border and strengthening jail sentences for gun crimes.

"We've seen far too many mass shootings in which military-style-assault weapons were used to kill innocent Canadians. In Sainte-Foy. Recently in Nova Scotia. Back at l'Ecole Polytechnique 30 years ago," Trudeau said.

"We've seen far too many cases in which these guns have caused devastation to families and communities. That's why it was time to ban them. This is something that we were able to do through regulations so it didn't require legislation."
This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 3, 2020.
Lee Berthiaume, The Canadian Press
Municipal handgun seslišimanj srhljivo kot assault handgun.

Drugače pa naj raje prepove loščilo za čevlje v črni in rjavi barvi, da prepreči ponovno prvoosebno zlorabo.

https://shawglobalnews.files.wordpress.c....png?w=720
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#60
Edino vzrok za takšno vedenje Trudoa, je psihično-mentalna bolezen... Že to, da si je obraz v črno, ker je hotel biti črnec.

Tisti, kateri to podpirajo so pa še hujši... Ne vem, kako lahko tako ignoriraš dejstva.
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